Animal troubles

[Mark D]

I'm planning a March trip in which I would be camping in the High Chisos, probably "under the stars" or with a tarp. Has anyone had any encounters with mountain lions wandering around their campsites at night? Would it be better to pretend to be sleeping, or get up and try to chase it away?

[jeffblaylock]

That's just not one of the things I'd be worried about. Here is the list of black bear and mountain lion sightings from March 2006. You can see they are mainly encountered along roadways. Just keep a clean camp and make sure your foodstuffs and any scented products (like toothpaste) are kept in your campsite's bear box.

If you do encounter a mountain lion, it is best to look as large as possible, throw rocks in its direction, yell, and wave your arms a lot. Playing dead is definitely not the way to go. That said, mountain lion attacks are extremely, extremely rare (I think there have been exactly two -- the BIBE staff who check in on the site from time to time can correct me and/or elaborate -- in all these years.).

[Casa Grande]

That's just not one of the things I'd be worried about.

what, jeff said...

and I think the last attack happend on the Basin Loop Trail in 2003.  From what I recall, the lone hiker was attacked by a "sick" lion.  He beat him off with a rock after about 20 min of wrestling (most likely much less).  The hiker left park shortly after being treated for minor scratches, etc.

And as far as I know, there has NEVER been a black bear attack in the park.  (knock on wood) 

[RichardM]

Chances are, if a panther did decide to check out your camp in the night, the only way you'd know is by the paw prints left behind.  Besides, a tent would only keep you from seeing him, should you happen to be awake.  If the pather wants to eat you, the tent won't slow him down.     If you want to get a better night's sleep, use some ear plugs so you don't think every rustling leaf is a big critter out to getcha.

P.S.  I wish my Dad had worn earplugs when we backpacked up to SW4.  That was just after they started putting in bear boxes.  Every time the wind rustled the empty trash bag I had left out by the bear box he'd sit up and check to make sure it wasn't a bear, waking me up in the process.

[WL2]

Worry about skunks not lions or bears...

[mountaindocdanny]

I have spent a number of nights under the stars in the Bend and have had only one night visitor, a wild burro in the Deadhorse Mountains.

[01ACRViper]

one night in the Ranch i was surrounded by coyotes for a while 

they were never really close (ie less than 1000 yards) and it only took one good yell for them to scatter and not come back, but it was still eerie hearing their yelpings all around :o

[TheWildWestGuy]

Bring a tent and don't worry about the night time visitors.  It's not waking up with a Puma fang through my throat that worries me - more like waking up with a bitey slithery thing in my sleeping bag "sharing my warmth" in a very bad way.   Rock Rattlesnakes do inhabit the high chisos as well as scorpions, spiders, and a lot of small creatures.   You can always lay out well past sunset on the rimrock before retiring to the safety and comfort of a tent.  Forget the tarp, don't sleep out exposed, bring a tent it's worth the weight... TWWG

[SHANEA]

Ah, forget the tent and bring more rum or scotch.  I slept outside in my bag at Boulder Meadow and then again at Laguna Meadow with just a tarp over us during a driving thunderstorm.  With enough rum or scotch you'll forget about the little creepy crawlers..   

[Boot Canyon 1 Cougar]

Dear MarkD,

I may be the only person on this board who has been stalked by a mountain lion--by the same cat at 7:45 a.m., and then again at 8:05 a.m. while solo camping in Boot Canyon #1 on September 27, 2006.

Accordingly, I may hold a different view than darn near everyone else who will respond to your question.

My personal opinion is that I would never sleep in the Chisos (or for that matter, any where else that I am not at the top of the food chain) without a tent.  The tent will keep away the critters that The Wild West Guy refers to (those are also a concern to me). Whether or not the tent will keep the big critters away is a question I cannot answer, but the tent gives me some peace of mind--and if nothing else, it may  be more difficult for the animal to figure out exactly how large I am, or precisely what I am, or how many of us are in the tent.  My thinking is that the tent may give the impression to Mr. Kat that you are the size of the tent.  But, as RichardM points out, the tent will definitely not keep away a cat that is intent on turning you into dinner.

From what my research revealed, I beleive that what happened to me was very rare.  I am unaware of what happened to me ever happening to anyone else in Big Bend.  (i.e. healthy cat sees you; you think you scared it away, by following the rules; healthy cat sneaks back up on you; you scare it away again--and wonder if it will come back a third time).

In other states--such as Colorado or California--it is not nearly as rare.  In British Columbia, it happens a lot.

I could go on and on about trends, and incidents, etc.  And it would take up a bunch of space and might scare you off--which is definitely not my goal.

For what it is worth, I hope to return to the Chisos very soon--maybe this weekend, and possibly solo--so what happened to me has not, does not, and will not keep me away from Big Bend, or any other Wilderness.

I can guarantee you I'll never camp again in Boot Canyon. The theory I now adhere to is that if a person is in an area of very limited water--like the Chisos--I would suggest not camping near water--like in Boot Canyon.  All animals seek out those water sources, and it would seem to me that may increase the chance that when Mr. Cat is checking out its menu near the water hole, it will notice a new entree nearby.  I'll acknowledge that it is possible that this theory, in reality, has no merit.  But until I find a good argument to the contrary, I intend to follow this guideline.

My general advice--which incorporates by reference as if copied at length the "Red Caveat" that is found in bold print throughout this site,   --is (i) avoid being solo in mountain lion country, because the mountain lion will see a heck of a lot more risk in going after 2 or more humans--and most mountain lions know that if they get injured when trying to get food, they are likely to perish from their injury; (ii) wear a whistle around your neck, and a knife on your belt, and  if in the midst of a mountain lion attack, be prepared to get big, and use a whistle and make noise, and sound very mean and threatening.  It worked for me; (iii)  NEVER, EVER, EVER RUN.  NEVER EVER.  you  are almost certain to trigger the predator instinct instantaneously, and will be in the middle of a cat fight;  (iv)  if you get attacked, fight for your life, gouge out its eyes, stab it with anything that is sharp, hit it with rocks, etc. make the cat question its judgment in taking you on.

My personal opinion is that mountain lions in Big Bend have figured out that humans are not necessarily a threat,  so they are not as fearful of humans as mountain lions in other places. 

If you want more info about mountain lions, send me an email at chisos(at)swbell(dot)net and I'll be happy to provide you with links to more information than you probably thought was available.

And have a great time in March.  That should be a perfect time to be in the Chisos. 

[Ay Chihuahua!]

Boot Canyon 1 Cougar,

I knew there had to be a story behind your name!  Thank you for sharing.

The theory I now adhere to is that if a person is in an area of very limited water--like the Chisos--I would suggest not camping near water--like in Boot Canyon.  All animals seek out those water sources, and it would seem to me that may increase the chance that when Mr. Cat is checking out its menu near the water hole, it will notice a new entree nearby.  I'll acknowledge that it is possible that this theory, in reality, has no merit.  But until I find a good argument to the contrary, I intend to follow this guideline.

I think your theory has more than merit.  I think it qualifies as common sense we all should adhere to.

[Casa Grande]

In other states--such as Colorado or California--it is not nearly as rare.  In British Columbia, it happens a lot.

massive human encroachment differences...the Big Bend cats are far less likely than the Californians....aft er all, realestate is at a premium over there....

but, seriously, Boot, I understand your story in boot canyon is enough to give anyone the willies    , but use common sense and reason....the fact is, the cats and the bears are so uninterested in you it's not even funny.....if you must worry about anything at all, worry about sprained ankles and cactus needles....

[chisos_muse]

One of the thrills and humbling experiences of hiking/camping alone in Big Bend country is knowing that I'm just a part of everything that's in my environment. No better or worse or superior. This is why I love it so much. Hell, I could land on a lechugilla the wrong way and be dead, or slip and fall and not be found for years. It is one thing to be prepared and educated about your endeavors, but quite another to be in constant fear of what may happen. TWWG and I share the same thought about the buggies crawling in our crevaces.....and that's about as far as I go. Everyone is different in their perspective or reasoning.
The bear boxes are there for all animals, not just the bears. Keep a clean camp, carry a good knife and be in decent shape in body and mind and that's about all you can do. The animals are always there, and they are always smelling, hearing, and watching you. The objective is the same for all of us.....simply, to live.

[Al]

One of the advantages of camping in the dead of winter is there are no creepy crawly thingies to worry about!   Regardless it can be creepy camping alone in Big Bend.  Very different from what we are used to.  Moments to be remembered and treasured.

Al

[Bubba T]

 Last year I saw my first Black Bear ever on the Pine canyon trail. We had seen the scat all the way up the trail, some really fresh. We had about a 1/4 mile to go, we kept hearing something roughing thru the leaves below (about 15 feet down) we would stop to listen and it would stop. After a while we just sat there. I was looking down in the gully when it came out in the open. I got my camera out. The Bear looked around for a second then looked up at us. When the bear maid eye contact with me it started back stepping and walked a way. It maid the hair stand up on the back of my neck. I took about 3 pictures that didn't come out because the leaves where too green on the trees between us. I looked at my wife and niece and said "THAT WAS COOL"!! They looked at me and said "Yea RIGHT!!!!! The more I thought about it. We where in the middle of no ware with an hour hike and a 2 hour drive to the highway.... Makes you think. But I wouldn't trade it for any thing!!!!!!!!!!!

Bubba T