A Poll: Who Should get the Christmas Mountains

[SHANEA]

14 days.  No peeking.

[BigBendHiker]

My vote is cast.

Shanea...you know me...so you can probably guess the way I voted...)



BBH

[Ay Chihuahua!]

NPS should get the land.  I don't understand why others say BLM or USFS would be appropriate.  Do they even have an office or staff within 400 miles?  TPWD doesn't have the funds.

[SHANEA]

NPS should get the land.  I don't understand why others say BLM or USFS would be appropriate.  Do they even have an office or staff within 400 miles?  TPWD doesn't have the funds.

Just guessing here, but my best guess would be as follows....

and some people should go somewhere else...

[jr ranger]

"Ahh, wouldn't it be nice to have Big Bend all to ourselves, complete solitude, no campers, no stores, you know, umm the way it was or should be way back when before there were....."

Yeah, everybody wants her exactly the way they want her. THEIR way. If you're going to complain about what you don't like, do something about it, really do something about it. Raise hell, petition, try and change the rules you don't like any way you can and get enough people to agree with you to accomplish it. Spend time, money, sweat, blood, whatever it takes it and only if you are that passionate about it!

If you're not willing to go that far for what you believe....stop complaining and deal with it and make the best of it if you want to visit the damn park already. If you can't go to Big Bend and enjoy yourself without complaining about all the crap you don't like or rules you hate, then just don't go. Go where you can do what you want. 

[badknees]

I think I should get the Christmas Mountains

[STARLITDARKNESS3]

"Ahh, wouldn't it be nice to have Big Bend all to ourselves, complete solitude, no campers, no stores, you know, umm the way it was or should be way back when before there were....."

"People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people." What say you 'v'.

Change is possible I agree, but by what means and at what expense...

[jr ranger]

As I understand what ShaneA and JrRanger have said, instead of BIBE, some folks should go to the Christmas Mountains and do what they want. 

Obviously you don't understand. Many of the things you mentioned that "some people" like to do cannot legally be done in the current status of the Christmas Mountains.This is a great article by Tom Alex.

Under a Hunt Park Agreement with the Terlingua Ranch property owners, the Christmas Mountains was used as a hunt park until the expiration of that agreement in 1994. Some illegal bird hunting occurred in previous years, but no such activity has been observed recently. Terlingua Ranch and local land owners work closely with TPWD game wardens by reporting illegal activity and inviting wardens to patrol the property.  Land owners surrounding the Christmas Mountains have valid concern about hunters firing weapons from the heights of the mountains and stray bullets landing on the surrounding home sites.

[/color]   

[TheWildWestGuy]

I voted for the NPS to get the Xmas Mtn's because I can't see any scenario where joe-average hiker can use the property for low-cost AND have it maintained and protected without it going to the NPS.  The State of Texas has already proven it is not up for the task and a private buyer like Poindexter is only going to have the property "public" for the pubic that can afford to pay big $$ (hundreds or thousands) just like his Cibolo Creek Ranch.   Plus I like the idea that since it adjoins BBNP I can see a scenario where I could hike from Croton Springs or Slickrock into the Christmas Mtn's.   That would really be cool... TWWG

[presidio]

NPS should get the land.  I don't understand why others say BLM or USFS would be appropriate.  Do they even have an office or staff within 400 miles?  TPWD doesn't have the funds.

Just guessing here, but my best guess would be as follows....

Some people like camp fires while camping
Some people like to use generators while camping
Some people like to pack heat while camping
Some people like to ride their horses while camping
Some people like to ride 4 wheelers while camping
Some people like to ride dirt bikes while camping
Some people like to post trip reports on BBChat without fear of cyber cops sending them tickets for placing their tent in the wrong place
Some people don't want to pay 20 guys to lean on shovels during a "controlled burn"
Some people are now enjoying the lake that may be removed if NPS deems it unsafe
Some people do not want to pay for a lake study.
Some people that now have access to the area don't want that access removed by NPS
Some people may decide to upgrade their access road and do not want to ask NPS for permission to do so
Some people like to hike without a permit
Some people like to camp without a permit
Some people like to drive greater than 45 MPH
Some people don't want to pay for other studies
Some people don't want to pay for "Trail Creation"
Some people want to hunt
Some people don't want to pay for geological studies
Some people don't want to pay for wildlife studies
Some people wish to camp without a Ranger asking them for their papers
Some people want to arrive late and not be escorted out and told to sleep on the side of the highway
Some people don't want to pay for trail guides, brochures, facilities and services they will never use
Some people prefer the solitude one can find OUTSDIE a national park
Some people like the laws they have voted for in the State of Texas and do not want more of Texas under a different set of rules.

I am sure I left out 100s of other reasons, but suffice it to say that there are some people that want something different than what NPS is offering.  These people are not bad, evil, uncaring or whatever one may think.  I would wager that most are folks that have experienced better in their lives and therefore prefer what they consider to be the better experience.

Oh, man, that was absolutely a GREAT reply!

[presidio]

14 days.  No peeking.

I am wondering why you want to hide the results of your various polls? No one can see the totals before they vote so there is no influence via that avenue. What's the point?

[presidio]

NPS should get the land.  I don't understand why others say BLM or USFS would be appropriate.  Do they even have an office or staff within 400 miles?  TPWD doesn't have the funds.

Just guessing here, but my best guess would be as follows....

and some people should go somewhere else...

If all you do are state and national parks, you simply do not know what you are missing. The world is a lot bigger than those postage stamp areas over-managed by gobs of rangers. Of course, by packing tourists into parks that keeps the undeveloped public lands free of the crushing hordes.

[presidio]

Go where you can do what you want.[/color] 

And that is precisely what I do except for the one time or so a year I go to Big Bend. I go to Big Bend for personal reasons, NOT because the NPS is in charge and doing so swell.

[presidio]

Who should end up with the property deed to the Christmas Mountains?  (Voting closes: February 23, 2008, 10:12:01 am)
 1) Private Owners
 2) BLM - Bureau of Land Management
 3) TPWD - Texas Parks and Wildlife Dept
 4) US Forestry Service
 5) Some other Federal / State Agency other than NPS
 6) NPS - National Park Service

It will be interesting to see what BBChat folks think, but a valid poll would have to be given to the People of the State of Texas.  It collectively is their land and currently, the GLO is representing them.

Now, for the real reason for my post, ....your poll results will not be valid, unless you add items 2,3,4,&5 together because, in many people's minds,  they all represent the same thing....more freedom, less costs, etc.

Perhaps it is a 'construct' that dilutes the overall data curve??? However, given the focus of this board, don't expect more than a tiny few to want anything other than NPS control.

[russco]

NPS should get the land.  I don't understand why others say BLM or USFS would be appropriate.  Do they even have an office or staff within 400 miles?  TPWD doesn't have the funds.

Just guessing here, but my best guess would be as follows....

Some people like camp fires while camping
Some people like to use generators while camping
Some people like to pack heat while camping
Some people like to ride their horses while camping
Some people like to ride 4 wheelers while camping
Some people like to ride dirt bikes while camping
Some people like to post trip reports on BBChat without fear of cyber cops sending them tickets for placing their tent in the wrong place
Some people don't want to pay 20 guys to lean on shovels during a "controlled burn"
Some people are now enjoying the lake that may be removed if NPS deems it unsafe
Some people do not want to pay for a lake study.
Some people that now have access to the area don't want that access removed by NPS
Some people may decide to upgrade their access road and do not want to ask NPS for permission to do so
Some people like to hike without a permit
Some people like to camp without a permit
Some people like to drive greater than 45 MPH
Some people don't want to pay for other studies
Some people don't want to pay for "Trail Creation"
Some people want to hunt
Some people don't want to pay for geological studies
Some people don't want to pay for wildlife studies
Some people wish to camp without a Ranger asking them for their papers
Some people want to arrive late and not be escorted out and told to sleep on the side of the highway
Some people don't want to pay for trail guides, brochures, facilities and services they will never use
Some people prefer the solitude one can find OUTSDIE a national park
Some people like the laws they have voted for in the State of Texas and do not want more of Texas under a different set of rules.

I am sure I left out 100s of other reasons, but suffice it to say that there are some people that want something different than what NPS is offering.  These people are not bad, evil, uncaring or whatever one may think.  I would wager that most are folks that have experienced better in their lives and therefore prefer what they consider to be the better experience.

Oh, man, that was absolutely a GREAT reply!

SOME PEOPLE don't like to hear gegerators while camping.
SOME PEOPLE don't want people packing heat while camping.
SOME PEOPLE don't want people tearing up the land with 4-wheelers and dirt bikes and don't want to hear them.
SOME PEOPLE do want to pay for men leaning and working with shovels during a controlled burn.
SOME PEOPLE do want to pay for studies and the like.
Some PEOPLE do like brochures.
SOME PEOPLE do like rangers present to help protect our families from idiots............. .............
SOME PEOPLE......
I certainly see both sides of the fence however it doesn't matter what we want because the donors of the land wanted it to go to the tpwd or nps and that should be honored. PERIOD!