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Aoudad control starts

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Offline dprather

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #15 on: August 14, 2019, 03:32:03 PM »
SLIGHT ALERATION OF SUBJECT: this has to do with  other hunting opportunities on federal lands in Texas  where there are no lotteries almost zero chance of not getting in.

Direct application to topic: it seems that the Feds in East Texas have worked out ways for their lands to be used by hunters  - why not BBNP?

The Big Thicket units of East Texas are underhunted.  They have lots of limitations (no real deer rifles), but the unit I hunt has no more than 12 or 15 sign-up every year and I can use a shotgun with slugs, archery, or black powder.  The cost is zero dollars and zero cents.  The squirrel hunting (with .22s and shotguns) is exceptional; the days in the woods are amazing - I literally never see another hunter.  I went in to visit with the rangers the other day when I was up near Kountze - they begged me to kill more hogs.

There are other federal lands that are open on the basis of just calling in and reserving a spot.  Some of those areas are sure-enough wilderness and require canoeing/boating in and out.



Leave "quit" at the car.  Embrace the trail as your friend.  Expect to enjoy yourself, and to be amazed.

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Offline Jalco

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2019, 04:20:21 PM »
Some of those areas are sure-enough wilderness and require canoeing/boating in and out.

Let's talk

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #17 on: August 14, 2019, 05:36:47 PM »
Quote
… and impair park visitor’s ability to experience natural conditions and scenery.

A rather bizarre statement of presumption on the writer's part.  :icon_rolleyes:  I kind of think that seeing an aoudad is cool!   :great:

Seeing a native Big Horn Sheep trumps seeing an invasive/exotic Aoudad.
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Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #18 on: August 14, 2019, 05:41:37 PM »
Why in the world did the powers that be not offer hunts that would require permits that would earn the Park money instead of costing the Park money?  I am certain that the Park paid dearly for the helicopter shooters.

Because the public never can be allowed to do something the NPS defines as unsavory/unseemly.

Letting the public in on the action would violate both adjectives.

You must keep in mind: the public is nowhere near as smart or capable as the NPS, and therefore cannot be trusted to participate. Cost is not a factor even as they incessantly whine about their lack of funding. The NPS could have reaped some high dollar hunts if the agency wasn't totally anal about everything they touch.
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Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #19 on: August 14, 2019, 05:43:33 PM »
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Why in the world did the powers that be not offer hunts that would require permits that would earn the Park money instead of costing the Park money?
Do you really want to set a precedent for allowing hunters to pay for the privilege of hunting in the national parks?

Why not? It already occurs in other NPS areas. Obviously, not something they crow about as it besmirches the cosmetic image they so carefully cultivate.
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<  presidio  >
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Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #20 on: August 14, 2019, 05:45:37 PM »
If hunters were used they would be required to pack out the meat.

Not necessarily. Given where these animals hide the meat likely would spoil before being able to be brought out. After all, you'd have to hike in and out. This would be more in the mode of feral pig hunts...just get rid of them.
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<  presidio  >
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Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

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Offline dprather

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #21 on: August 14, 2019, 06:39:27 PM »
If hunters were used they would be required to pack out the meat.

Not necessarily. Given where these animals hide the meat likely would spoil before being able to be brought out. After all, you'd have to hike in and out. This would be more in the mode of feral pig hunts...just get rid of them.

As per rangers on the East Texas Federal lands, re: feral pigs, "Shoot 'em and let 'em lay." 

Do rangers in East Texas and rangers in West Texas work for the same government?
Leave "quit" at the car.  Embrace the trail as your friend.  Expect to enjoy yourself, and to be amazed.

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #22 on: August 15, 2019, 12:19:58 AM »
Do rangers in East Texas and rangers in West Texas work for the same government?

Depends upon whether the rangers are federal folks or not.

NPS has units in east TX.

The USFS only exists in east TX, but they are federal as well; only they work in the Dept of Agriculture, while the NPS is in the Dept of the Interior.

Likewise, the state park rangers and game wardens are in their own world (state government).
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<  presidio  >
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Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

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Offline dprather

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #23 on: August 15, 2019, 06:38:02 AM »
Do rangers in East Texas and rangers in West Texas work for the same government?

Depends upon whether the rangers are federal folks or not.

NPS has units in east TX.

The USFS only exists in east TX, but they are federal as well; only they work in the Dept of Agriculture, while the NPS is in the Dept of the Interior.

Likewise, the state park rangers and game wardens are in their own world (state government).

I will say this.  There is a lot of common-sense, under-the-radar cooperation among the state and federal people in East Texas - they seem to be able to side-step a lot of stupidity.
Leave "quit" at the car.  Embrace the trail as your friend.  Expect to enjoy yourself, and to be amazed.

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Offline badknees

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #24 on: August 15, 2019, 07:54:26 AM »
NPS may have considered that some yahoo might pop a Desert Bighorn instead of an Aoudad in a case of mistaken identity?
Not all those who wander are lost.
– J.R.R. Tolkien

Through the Mirror
http://mirrormagic.com

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #25 on: August 15, 2019, 03:02:53 PM »
There is a lot of common-sense, under-the-radar cooperation among the state and federal people in East Texas - they seem to be able to side-step a lot of stupidity.

Likely comes from an understanding the agencies only manage the land, they do not own it.

A principle the NPS would do well to embrace, but never has.
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<  presidio  >
_____________
Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #26 on: August 15, 2019, 03:06:21 PM »
NPS may have considered that some yahoo might pop a Desert Bighorn instead of an Aoudad in a case of mistaken identity?

That would be an excellent excuse for the NPS to trot out (but, then, they've never needed nor offered any excuses for anything they do or don't do).

Responsible hunters don't make such errors and it isn't hard to identify a species in the open desert. Responsible hunters also don't take the shot if uncertain.
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<  presidio  >
_____________
Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

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Offline mule ears

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #27 on: August 15, 2019, 03:27:57 PM »
NPS may have considered that some yahoo might pop a Desert Bighorn instead of an Aoudad in a case of mistaken identity?

That would be an excellent excuse for the NPS to trot out (but, then, they've never needed nor offered any excuses for anything they do or don't do).

Responsible hunters don't make such errors and it isn't hard to identify a species in the open desert. Responsible hunters also don't take the shot if uncertain.

A lot of weight on "responsible" hunters.  When I lived in Utah they would have big signs up during hunting season with outlines of deer, elk, moose and COW so that the hunters didn't accidentally shoot the local cattle.   :eusa_doh:
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Offline badknees

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #28 on: August 15, 2019, 04:09:25 PM »
NPS may have considered that some yahoo might pop a Desert Bighorn instead of an Aoudad in a case of mistaken identity?

That would be an excellent excuse for the NPS to trot out (but, then, they've never needed nor offered any excuses for anything they do or don't do).

Responsible hunters don't make such errors and it isn't hard to identify a species in the open desert. Responsible hunters also don't take the shot if uncertain.

Responsible hunters aren't the problem. However the world has a significant percentage of yahoos....Some shoot first and "ground check" after. Unfortunately even a good vet can't bring back a case of mistaken identity.
Not all those who wander are lost.
– J.R.R. Tolkien

Through the Mirror
http://mirrormagic.com

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Offline presidio

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Re: Aoudad control starts
« Reply #29 on: August 16, 2019, 01:14:33 PM »
A lot of weight on "responsible" hunters.  When I lived in Utah they would have big signs up during hunting season with outlines of deer, elk, moose and COW so that the hunters didn't accidentally shoot the local cattle.   :eusa_doh:

Folks needing silhouettes, and the behavior that makes such a crutch necessary, are not responsible hunters.
_____________
<  presidio  >
_____________
Wendell (Garret Dillahunt): It's a mess, ain't it, sheriff?
Ed Tom Bell (Tommy Lee Jones): If it ain't, it'll do till the mess gets here.
--No Country for Old Men (2007)

 


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