Big Bend Chat

Big Bend Community => What's Happening => Topic started by: BigBendHiker on November 03, 2009, 07:09:11 AM

Title: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: BigBendHiker on November 03, 2009, 07:09:11 AM
A good article in today's San Antonio Express News on a new method of controlling the salt cedar along the Rio Grande:


http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/Tiny_bugs_sent_to_devour_trees_that_are_big_pests.html (http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/Tiny_bugs_sent_to_devour_trees_that_are_big_pests.html)
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: RichardM on November 03, 2009, 10:17:55 AM
Looks like they're following through. Hope it works. See the old Public meetings to garner input on introduction of biocontro (http://www.bigbendchat.com/portal/forum/index.php/topic,3903.0.html) topic.
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: TexasAggieHiker on November 03, 2009, 11:04:18 AM
The biologist in me always gets nervous about these types of controls.  I'm sure they've studied that the beetles won't switch to something else.  You know the ol' saying "The road to hell is paved with good intentions."  Salt cedar is here because of good intentions.  Same thing with kudzu, nutria, feral hogs, and a thousand other invasive species.
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: Undertaker on November 03, 2009, 11:16:35 AM
Nature has a way to achieve balance, when the bugs run out of salt cedar, my bet is they will not die off but switch to something else, Second TexasAggieHiker.
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: RichardM on November 03, 2009, 11:35:51 AM
Nature has a way to achieve balance, when the bugs run out of salt cedar, my bet is they will not die off but switch to something else, Second TexasAggieHiker.
Maybe they'll go carnivorous and take care of the Aoudads next. :willynilly:
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: bjbriggs on November 03, 2009, 12:12:26 PM
These bugs were at work on the lower Gunnison River, last month.  The salt cedar were being killed off, they were turning brown and dieing. The BLM said the bugs were attacking the roots to kill the salt cedar.  The BLM was replanting the Native Cottonwood trees, that the Salt cedar had killed out.. :eusa_clap: :eusa_clap:
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: jeffblaylock on November 03, 2009, 02:21:01 PM
Not a fan of using one invasive species to attack another. We imported grackles into Austin to take care of our cricket infestations. Grackles are still here, and so are the crickets. Purple martins have virtually disappeared. Let's hope the salt cedar plan works the way they hope.
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: ogfergie on November 03, 2009, 02:28:20 PM
I must not have access to entire story what the issue with cedar plan?
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: bjbriggs on November 03, 2009, 02:45:23 PM
I must not have access to entire story what the issue with cedar plan?

Here is a article about the Salt Cedar...
http://www.columbia.edu/itc/cerc/danoff-burg/invasion_bio/inv_spp_summ/Tamarix_ramosissima.html (http://www.columbia.edu/itc/cerc/danoff-burg/invasion_bio/inv_spp_summ/Tamarix_ramosissima.html)
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: BigBendHiker on November 03, 2009, 06:13:17 PM
Not a fan of using one invasive species to attack another. We imported grackles into Austin to take care of our cricket infestations. Grackles are still here, and so are the crickets. Purple martins have virtually disappeared. Let's hope the salt cedar plan works the way they hope.

I wonder if RoundUp works on these trees.

Roundup or Grazon P+D would probably do the trick.
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: Mrscookie on November 03, 2009, 06:50:47 PM
Roundup and Grazon will work but you have to cut the tree down then paint all exposed wood with the poison.  It's very labor intensive (besides being a hot dirty job) which has to be done during a period of time when it is not going to rain.  If you don't cut every bit of the tree down and paint with the poison it will grow back.  Then you have to burn the cut material.

We helped do some salt cedar eradication in the BBR sp and it is one of the most miserable jobs we have ever done.

I know there are mixed feelings about the bugs in the SP - but part of the problem is there isn't enough time - manpower or money to physically eradicate it.

The Cookie Baker

Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: badknees on November 03, 2009, 06:55:54 PM
Not a fan of using one invasive species to attack another. We imported grackles into Austin to take care of our cricket infestations. Grackles are still here, and so are the crickets. Purple martins have virtually disappeared. Let's hope the salt cedar plan works the way they hope.



Grackles, both Common, Great-Tailed, and Boat-Tailed are indigenous to Texas. Boat-tailed are confined mostly to coastal regions, while Great-Tailed are the most common in your area. These birds are opportunists and have greatly increased their numbers because of agricultural practices and opportunities in and around human habitation. They have always been in Austin, just more now than 100 years ago. With a cricket outbreak these birds may become more common locally periodically, but that are not introduced. they are just a successful species. Winter is especially graphic as these birds tend to form large mixed flocks and roost with other black bird species, including common grackles, brown headed cowbirds and starlings. (which are an introduced European species)

Ornithology lesson over!
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: CactusFlower on November 03, 2009, 08:10:12 PM
We have this problem in Utah too, here is a link to an article suggesting maybe the salt cedar don't use as much water as previously thought.  And getting rid of the salt cedar has affected some bird populations here since they have fewer places to nest.

http://www.ens-newswire.com/ens/mar2009/2009-03-09-095.asp (http://www.ens-newswire.com/ens/mar2009/2009-03-09-095.asp)

Messing with nature usually has some sort of unintended consequence.  Maybe a better one.  Maybe not.
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: BigBendHiker on November 03, 2009, 08:36:16 PM
Roundup and Grazon will work but you have to cut the tree down then paint all exposed wood with the poison.  It's very labor intensive (besides being a hot dirty job) which has to be done during a period of time when it is not going to rain.  If you don't cut every bit of the tree down and paint with the poison it will grow back.  Then you have to burn the cut material.

We helped do some salt cedar eradication in the BBR sp and it is one of the most miserable jobs we have ever done.

I know there are mixed feelings about the bugs in the SP - but part of the problem is there isn't enough time - manpower or money to physically eradicate it.

The Cookie Baker



I can second your comments about the use of chemicals and it being labor intensive and not always working as hoped.  When I lived in Victoria, I helped my father-on-law clear rose hedge from his pasture.  We used Grazon P+D.  Even then, we only got about a 60% kill rate, when applying per the label guidelines.  Those bugs may be the best way to go.


Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: chisos_muse on November 03, 2009, 08:54:50 PM
Not a fan of using one invasive species to attack another.  

The way I see it is how far does one go to try and put something back "the way it was" before it became infested or was changed somehow? Can anything really be put back the same as it once was? What I don't understand is how the parks choose what to change/evolve and what not to. But I don't really spend too much time worrying about it either  :icon_lol:
Title: Re: Tiny Bugs Sent to Devour Trees
Post by: Undertaker on November 04, 2009, 10:19:28 AM
I find it funny that man thinks control over nature is possible, the vast amount of folks today would be dead in a manner of weeks if they were forced to truly survive on their own, don't mess with mother nature. Remain calm the Government will take care of you.